[3view] knife moving problem

Małgorzata Śliwińska m.sliwinska at nencki.gov.pl
Thu Aug 23 09:27:21 CEST 2018


 

Hi Ilya, 

Thank you very much for answer, I refer to your comments in the text
below: 

> Hi Gosia, 
> 
> 1. 
> 
> I agree with Joergen, it is difficult to target the problem. Especially, since it happened only few times during the year. Your events also may be due to certain accidents, such as miscommunication between DM and the knife controller (perhaps, in the second case with the error message: 3View record aborted:Timeout moving knife position to NEAR). 
> 
> I am on DM 2, you can be wright with the suggestion about miscommunication as I have some other problems (see attached pictures). 
> 
> This error occurs more often (already more than 20 times!) and during the scan normally. Than the communicate at Gatan computer appears first (3View communicate picture) and immediately another on microscope (microscope communicate). When it happen I lose a control over the microscope, the console is dead, I can not change magnification or anything and it is impossible to turn off the EHT or go to HV/VP mode but the scan goes on as long as I do not stop it. In this situation I have to turn off everything (with EHT on, and server gives error communicate-see attached), press the yellow button on microscope (standby mode) and after a while turn it on back on green button. This time the microscope computer do not starts automatically and I have to turn it on manually. Some popping up windows appear like that the computer can not read the EHT, and vacuum value and "Application SmartSem version 5.5 with service pack 6 08-April-13 failed to register successfully" 
> 
> Normally I start the Smart Sem, turn off EHT, next turn on EHT again and open Digital micrograph. After the error like this DM shows no windows, which I normally have and I have to open them from the panel (floating windows layout). Sometimes there is no Digi Scan connected, so I restart the computer again. 
> 
> 2. 
> 
> With the other symptoms, I also had a weird case when I suppose to cut but nothing was going on for several microns. Basically, I just opened the chamber, lowered the stage and re-approached. This accident never happened again. 
> 
> In my case the same happen already 2 times and the "3View record aborted:Timeout moving knife position to NEAR" situation happen also twice (one of the during the night when nobody was at work), so I do not feel safe to leave scans overnight ;-( What if it finally unblock and start cutting again? 
> 
> 3. 
> 
> You may try to check the contact that Joergen suggested (I am don't know where it is myself). I would just keep monitoring the system and if the same accidents occur 3 times or more start to worry. If the event is not reproducible it will be very difficult to tackle the problem and you might ending up in replacing part after part. 
> 
> Is anybody from GATAN on this mailing list? How much does it cost to invite GATAN specialist to diagnose the problem? As far as I know we do not have GATAN representative in Poland and the Zeiss who sold us the setup wash their hands of anything connected with GATAN devices ;-( 
> 
> Thanks 
> 
> Gosia 
> 
> Are you on DM2 or GMS3? 
> 
> Best regards, 
> 
> Ilya 
> 
> -------------------------------------------------------------- 
> 
> Ilya Belevich, PhD 
> 
> Senior researcher, Electron Microscopy Unit 
> 
> Institute of Biotechnology, PL56 (Viikinkaari 9) 
> 
> University of Helsinki, 00014 FINLAND 
> 
> phone: +358-2-941-59497 email: ilya.belevich(AT)helsinki.fi 
> 
> web: http://www.biocenter.helsinki.fi/~ibelev 
> 
> FROM: 3view-bounces at open-em.org [mailto:3view-bounces at open-em.org] ON BEHALF OF Malgorzata Sliwinska
> SENT: Wednesday, August 22, 2018 6:20 PM
> TO: Mailing list for Gatan 3View Serial Block-Facing <3view at open-em.org>
> SUBJECT: Re: [3view] knife moving problem 
> 
> Hi Joergen, 
> 
> Thank you for your suggestions. Would it be possible for you to send me a picture showing what you mean by electric wire which bend over time? I would like to try to bend it back. I hope it is not a motor as I am able to cut, after error I start new scan and it is working fine for two hours now... How to check if it is because of cutter piezo? 
> 
> Generally can I do everything myself or I need to call Gatan? 
> 
> Thanks a lot 
> 
> Gosia 
> 
> Małgorzata Śliwińska, PhD
> 
> Laboratory of Imaging Tissue Structure and Function 
> 
> Nencki Institute of Experimental Biology Polish Academy of Sciences
> 
> 3 Pasteur Street, 02-093 Warsaw, Poland
> 
> Phone: +48 22 589 2502
> 
> www.nencki.gov.pl [1]
> 
> W dniu 2018-08-22 16:34, Joergen Kornfeld napisał(a): 
> 
> Hi Gosia, 
> 
> it is a bit hard to diagnose for me from the description, but it might be the "cutter motor" or the detection mechanism that tests in which position the cutter arm is. For imaging, the whole knife holding arm is moved away from the sample (this may be what you mean by CLEAR position), but then returned over the sample for cutting. This position is detected by an electric wire contact, which might bend over time so that it is not functional anymore and the cutter arm can get stuck (just bending it back would fix it then). Another possibility is that the cutter motor itself is broken (the entire arm with the knife does not move anymore, needs replacement of the motor) or that the knife piezo does not work anymore (the diamond cannot slide over the sample anymore during approach, needs replacement of the cutter piezo). 
> 
> Maybe this helps, 
> 
> Joergen 
> 
> Am 8/22/2018 um 4:14 PM schrieb Małgorzata Śliwińska: 
> 
> Dear All, 
> 
> Recently I have experienced three times a problem with knife moving in 3View. 
> 
> I the middle of the scan the knife stopped cutting. The pictures were collected, I hear clicking from the knife driver, so it seems that everything is working but 20 consecutive pictures were the same, no cutting. My impression is that the table with the sample was moving up but the knife was blocked in CLEAR position. When it happened I opened the chamber, lower the stage and approached the sample again (because I was afraid that if the knife unblock finally, it will hit the sample and be damaged). After restart the scan continued properly. 
> 
> Today it happen again, but this time the scan was stopped automatically and I received the message: "3View record aborted:Timeout moving knife position to NEAR" 
> 
> Also from one year on I have been observing, that while cutting with open chamber, around the 12-17th slice I hear the sound like "boing" of the metal spring (I did not observed any blockade with the open chamber but I suspect that it can be the problem of the spring responsible for moving the knife arm...) 
> 
> Does anybody experience similar problem? Does it concern a part easily exchangeable or is it a bigger problem? I am afraid to leave 3View working unattended till I fix this problem ;-( 
> 
> I would be grateful for any advice 
> 
> Best regards 
> 
> Gosia 
> 
> Małgorzata Śliwińska, PhD
> 
> Laboratory of Imaging Tissue Structure and Function 
> 
> Nencki Institute of Experimental Biology Polish Academy of Sciences
> 
> 3 Pasteur Street, 02-093 Warsaw, Poland
> 
> Phone: +48 22 589 2502
> 
> www.nencki.gov.pl [1]
> 
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> 
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> 
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> 
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> 
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